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26 September 2007

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Margaret

It is very sad that people are still missing, and unaccounted for. But it is also sad if the fate of these men and women is allowed to continue to stifle the lives of those living in Cyprus today. I read the conflicting accounts on this site. Are the Turks lying? Are the Greek Cypriots choosing to ignore the part that Enosis played in the catastrophe?

http://www.cyprus-conflict.net/Greek%20v%20Turk%20narr%20-%201974.htm

"In an article on 28th February 1976 in the Greek Cypriot press Father Papatsestos said: "In is a rather hard thing to say, but it is true that the Turkish intervention saved us from a merciless internecine war. The Sampson regime had prepared a list of all Makarios supporters, and they would have slaughtered them all." Many of the people saved by Turkey are members of the present Greek Cypriot leadership.

During the fighting with Turkish troops between 20th July and 16th August 1974 many Greek Cypriots died in combat. So far as possible their bodies were recovered and identified by Turkish forces. There were very few deaths of Greek Cypriots civilians.

The balance of probabilities is therefore that of those Greek Cypriots still listed as missing most were killed during the Sampson coup of 15th - 20th July 1974, and that others died in combat. Some are in mass graves such as those described by Father Papatsestos, and the remainder have no known grave. Those killed in the fighting with the Turkish army would not have died if the Greek Cypriots and Greece had not tried to annihilate the Turkish Cypriots and annex the island to Greece, and the blame for their deaths must rest firmly upon their own leadership."

I don't know where the truth lies, but neither can you. Perhaps nobody does - at this remove - know the truth. Wouldn't everyone be better trying to find a settlement rather than keeping old wounds open?

Margaret

You could have a look at this too?

http://www.tcn-cy.freeuk.com/lanitis.htm

Ignoring the rant at the beginning, this is more of the same ...

http://www.newsgroups-index.com/group/soc_-culture_-slovenia_l40.html

http://www.geocities.com/t_volunteer/cyprus/priest.htm

and the section on the massacre of Turkish Cypriot civilians in this link ...

http://www.ataturk.com/content/view/30/65/

Finally, since I expect you've had enough by now, on 3rd March 1996 the Greek Cypriot Cyprus Mail wrote: "(Greek) Cypriot governments have found it convenient to conceal the scale of atrocities during the 15th July coup in an attempt to downplay its contribution to the tragedy of the summer of 1974 and instead blame the Turkish invasion for all casualties. There can be no justification for any government that failed to investigate this sensitive humanitarian issue. The shocking admission by the Clerides government that there are people buried in Nicosia cemetery who are still included in the list of the "missing" is the last episode of a human drama which has been turned into a propaganda tool."


I had a look at the history of the Akritas Plan. That was interesting too.

Hermes

The crux of Margaret's post is this, "the Cypriots are a violent, obstinate people, essentially they are uncivilised and all they need is to take on Anglo-Saxon governance to set them straight"

However, she conveniantly ignores that the most disgusting role played in Cypriot affairs have been that of the English.

demonax

Margaret
I’m sorry to be so blunt – but you’re an idiot. Only an idiot puts forward the most abject articles and propaganda which they’ve found on the internet and declares they now have access to truth and knowledge. On top of being an idiot, you’re also arrogant. Why are you spouting forth on a subject – Cyprus – on which you clearly have no knowledge, no insight and no direct interest? What is your motivation? Who do you think you are? You think you know something about Cyprus Cypriots don’t? Don’t be so vain and ridiculous. Trust me, Margaret, I know about Cyprus. I know about the history, the politics, the refugees, the missing persons, what the Greek Cypriots did and didn’t do, what the Turkish Cypriots did and didn’t do – what Greece, Turkey, the UK and the US did and didn’t do – from every possible angle, I’ve read it all, heard it all – and you have nothing to say and no understanding of any of the issues involved. Do you know how mind-numbingly thick it is to speak about the Akritas plan? (Next you’ll be talking about the Protocols of the Elders of Zion). Any fool can go to a Turkish website and find the Turkish case on Cyprus. What does that prove – apart from the fact that your research skills are limited and your thinking lazy? What does quoting Lanitis or the priest prove? Why are their idiosyncratic views valid and the thousands of other contrary views – and the facts that support them – invalid? If I were you, and had, for whatever obscure reason – perhaps you’ve been on holiday to the island or enjoyed souvlaki in a Cypriot restaurant somewhere in the UK – an interest in Cyprus, rather than troubling yourself with your pathetic attempts to deconstruct the Greek Cypriot case – or what you think is the Greek Cypriot case, because you don’t really know what the Greek Cypriot is, do you? – I’d look into Britain’s role in partitioning the island, which you might be able to talk about less embarrassingly. Ignorance and arrogance are a bad combination. You should try harder to avoid the pitfalls.

Stavros, sorry about the harsh and personal language – but sometimes when someone speaks so stupidly and condescendingly, there is no alternative.

Margaret

Demonax, am I bothered?

I was asking questions, not supporting one side or the other. You're right, I am not qualified to make judgements about whether one side or the other has the monopoly of truth, and I am sorry if that is how it seems. I was not saying - at all - what Hermes says I was saying. I don't have a position, and am quite prepared to accept Britain's part in Cyprus's history. The fate of Cyprus concerns us all. You could say that being British, and the British having messed everything up, that I share a responsibility to facilitate a settlement... And I'm clearly not doing very well, so I'll shut up.

Feelings run high, that I can see. I now have a better idea of where people are coming from. Thank you, Stavros, for sharing your personal history. Perhaps you'd already written about it on this blog, in which case I apologise for not having picked it up.

Superman

U.N. Security Council resolution 1758, which of course, the Turks have ignored.


http://daccessdds.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/N07/384/24/PDF/N0738424.pdf?OpenElement

"Reiterating its call to the parties to assess and address the humanitarian issue
of all missing persons with due urgency and seriousness, and welcoming in this
regard the progress and continuation of the important activities of the Committee on
Missing Persons; expressing the hope that this process will promote reconciliation
between the communities,"

Also, it has been documented that the Turks used some of the missing as guinea pigs in its tests of chemical weapons...I can't remember where I read this though.

Ctheodorou

To those who say that the Cypriots are liars and terrorists I would like to point out this: 36 years later Cyprus is still occupied, 1619 persons are unaccounted for and 200000 people are scattered around the Globe not been able to return to their homes. This is not a lie . This is reported by the united nations and the red cross. Who are the invaters and the terrorizing power over a small peaceful island? Turkey of course. Who can dny that?

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